Jones: It is an execution week at Huntsville Prison, but the daily routine unchanged.
Music
Jones: We’d come to Huntsville’s Death Row to meet two young black men.
There are more executions here than anywhere in America.
Nineteen last year alone.
The execution chamber is being prepared for one of the men we’re here to see.
His name is Kenneth Harris.
In 1988 he was convicted of the rape and murder of a young white woman. He says he’ll speak to us the day before he’s killed.
The other man is Glenn McGinniss. He was convicted in 1992 for the shooting death of a white woman in a robbery.
McGinniss is waiting for a death date while his lawyers file appeals.
McGinniss: Recently, everybody coming through is really black. I mean, and it’s not so much being black, it’s the age group that we’re coming off in here. I mean we’re looking at fellows — I mean look at me — we spend the majority of our lives locked up, or what you, until they take us down there to do what they want to do.
Nunnelee: These eight cells is what remains of the original Death Row. It is now used as a holding area for the inmates who are scheduled for execution. They have a bed, a toilet and sink.
Jones: So this is now the death house?
Nunnelee: This is the Texas death house, yes. We presently have 8 cells here, but we only utilise one at a time. That’s the way we operate. We have had multiple executions in the past, but never have more than one individual here at a time.
Nunnelee: This is the execution chamber itself, which houses the gurney. At the appointed hour the inmate is removed from his cell by a team of officers and led in here and asked to get on the gurney.
McGinniss: They strap you to the table. Before they strap you to the table, a microphone is supposed to come down. Once you’re laying down like this here, what happens is they get you and they ask you do you have anything to add. And they tie a bag up into your rectum area or what have you, to keep you from running on yourself or what have you.
Nunnelee: He is strapped down. First at the ankles. He’ll also be strapped at the legs, at the waist, and across his chest. Lastly he’s wrists are inserted through these straps. At that time the execution team will enter the room, and insert needles in each arm.
McGinniss: You know you’re going down there and you’re going to be strapped to the table. They’re going to put a needle in your arm, but you don’t know what the actuality is going to be. And I really don’t want to know.
Jones; And at that point I think it is, the witnesses are able to come into these rooms here?
Nunnelee: Correct. Once the saline solution is flowing.
Jones: And what happens then?
Nunnelee: Once the witnesses are in place, the inmate is asked by the warden, who is standing at his head, if he has any last statement to make. We’ve had, on one occasion, an inmate actually confess his crime on the gurney. That’s happened once out of 106 executions.
McGinniss: We’re told that they have the victims family over here in this booth right here. I’ve never been there, so I couldn’t really tell you in great detail how things are set up.
Nunnelee: We have medical technicians perform the execution. There are three drugs involved.
McGinniss: They way they make it seem is you’re going to Hotel Heaven right.
Nunnelee: One being sodium Thiapenthol, which is similar to what you might get at a dentist’s office to put you under.
McGinniss: I don’t know nobody who came back and told me how it was.
Nunnelee: The second is a muscle relaxant that opens the diaphragm for the Potassium Chloride which stops the heart.
McGinniss: They say it’s like 8 minutes before the actuality of the death takes place.
Nunnelee: The reaction generally is a heaving of the chest and a gasping sound as the air leaves the lungs.
Jones: When you were arrested, how old were you?
McGinniss: Seventeen. And I’d been incarcerated practically five years prior to that. In some shape or form in and out, in and out.
Music
Jones: 2am in one of Houston’s black wards.
These are the streets on which both Glenn McGinniss and Kenneth Harris grew up.
Crack houses are scattered through the neighbourhood.
FX: Police siren.
Jones: This is a regular haunt of crack smokers. They buy from the boys in the street and come here.
The officer knows this young woman well. He’s arrested her before for possession of crack cocaine.
The drug also wove its way through the lives of both Harris and McGinniss.
As a young boy, Glenn McGinniss watched his mother, Sadie, become addicted, and destroy her life.
McGinniss: Oh, it tears you up inside. It makes you lazy, it makes you want to not eat anything no more, because once the stuff get off inside you, you’re walking around — If I could just give her a hamburger maybe she could gain some weight. It takes you from being this big, it draws you up and then you stop wanting to take care of your hair and you stop caring about your little face. It just seem like you don’t care no more.
Earli: He would know his mother was off into drugs and he would beg her not to use the drugs, because he hated drugs. As a matter of fact, he didn’t even smoke.
McGinniss: She would always say, I’m going to beat this thing, mac, and then me and you are going to be a family again. And I’m like ‘Yeah.’
Jones: As his mother’s life fell apart, the only member of his family Glenn McGinniss could rely on was his paternal grandmother, Earli Mae Brown.
Earli keeps the only photos taken of him as a child.
Earli: This is a photo of him when he’s a baby. He’s about a year old here. Fat little guy, isn’t he?
And this is him when he was in like the second grade. He was like 7 years old in this one. And this is one that I had made. Someone took that picture in the house. I didn’t even know Glenn was behind me. I had this one taken of him in prison.
Earli: He started getting into trouble when he was about 11 or 12 years old. He started taking things from people. I’d say he used to do this because he was lonesome. He wanted attention. Glenn Senior kind of like abandoned him. You know he wasn’t around when Glenn Junior needed him.
Glenn Senior: I tried to get him to stay with me after I got married, but his mother, she thought that if he stayed with me, that would mess up her welfare cheque, so she decided against it.
Jones: It was at this time, when Glenn was about 9 years old, that he was sexually abused by his mother’s boyfriend.
McGinniss: I called the police, because they were doing drugs in the house. So I guess I pretty much brought a lot of things on myself.
Jones: What did he do to you, though?
McGinniss: He raped me. Just sexually raped me.
I couldn’t stop myself from bleeding in the back and everything. I put toilet paper down there and everything, but it wouldn’t stop. My mum had some tampons, wrapped them all up in my underwear. Got my underwear, and tied a knot around my underwear like this here, and put on my favourite Lee jeans and went to school.
Delores: Drugs, drugs is terrible. A five year old can sell you some crack, which they have done, because they’re not going to arrest a small child.
Jones: Delores Hazen is the mother of Kenneth Harris. She says crack has destroyed a whole generation of poor blacks — her son’s generation.
Delores: We’ve lost a whole generation of children behind drugs. Everything that’s in prison, in Death Row they are from the ages of 25 to 34 years old. We’ve lost them peoples.
Jones: It’s a national phenomenon. It’s crowded prisons with young black men. Though blacks are only 12% of the American population, almost half of all prisoners are black — 800,000 of them.
That’s reflected in Death Row’s statistics, where 41% of inmates are black. And where blacks murdering whites are much more likely to be executed.
The young Kenneth Harris was no stranger to the drug scene, nor to other temptations.
Delores: His first child was born when he was 13.
Jones: How many children does Kenneth have?
Delores: Six children. Kenneth got four boys and two girls.
Jones: That’s a lot.
Delores: What can I say.
Jones: So how many mothers for those six children?
Delores: Six.
Jones: Doctors have estimated Harris’s IQ as between 55 and 70, and testified that he’s mentally retarded. But at the time of the murder, he was also addicted to crack.
Delores: He wouldn’t do harm to nobody. But drugs did a whole lot. Drugs will cause you to do a whole lot of things. I’ve seen this.
Jones: And Delores has seen it happen again. These are her grandchildren. Their mother, her daughter, was also a crack addict. She’s in jail now because Delores put her there, she says, to save her life.
Delores: She’s straight now. I watched my daughter go from 230 pounds to 98 pounds. I watched her almost die, high on drugs.
Jones: These people in particular, have no sympathy for murderers on Death Row, no matter what life circumstances might have led them to violence.
Jones: They are the families of murder victims. They argue powerfully against mercy for the killers.
Bob: They have to be removed from society like a rabid dog so that they don’t infect the rest of the population.
Mrs Kelly: When these people murder our children, they put us into their lives.
Jones: Mrs Linda Kelly was the first family member of a victim to witness an execution in Texas.
Mrs Kelly: I recommend people watching it. It’s lethal injection, it’s not a morbid thing. It’s nothing compared to the crime they commit. My 90 year old mother in law was there and witnessed it. And she’s a devout Catholic and she was glad that she was there. I do recommend it if someone gets the opportunity that they take it. Because that the only way they’re going to have closure and peace of mind as to what happened.
Jones: Just 48 hours before her son was due to die, Delores Hazen got the news that Kenneth Harris had been given a stay of execution.
Delores: I told Kenneth when I left, I said “Hey, keep faith. Don’t give up.”
Jones: The judge told Harris’s jury to ignore his crack addiction at the time of the murder. Now the appeal court must decide if that was a mistake.
Delores: It’s wonderful. I knew this was going to happen, because I believe in god. I never did give up faith.
Mrs Stonestreet: This is Lisa. She was 28 when she died. And she was a warm, wonderful, loving young lady. She graduated from high school with honours. She was at the top of her field as a legal secretary.
Delores: He was accused of murdering this legal secretary, Alicia Stonewall, whatever.
Mrs Stonestreet: The Lord kept impressing on us to forgive him. And when I made the decision it was just like the Lord taking a sheaf of wheat and burning it into my heart, where I could never go back on it again.
Delores: In America, it’s all about money. Any time it’s about black and white things, if a black man’s involved, he’s going to get the death penalty.
Mrs Stonestreet: The Scriptures say ‘If you take a life, you must lay your life down’ and I believe that.
Music
Jones: There’s a wide gap between black and white perceptions of justice.
A division as distinct as that between the races in Conroe, Texas — the small town where the 17 year old Glenn McGinniss was living, where he committed murder and where he was tried.
Earli: They had an all white jury, a Jim Crow town, white judge, white prosecuting attorney and white victim and a black defendant. So what kind of fair trial do you expect?
Jones: Bill Hall was Glenn McGinniss’s court appointed lawyer.
He’s a man with unusual hobbies.
Hall: Well they always swallow the fish head first...
Jones: And unconventional ideas for a town like Conroe, which was once famous for lynching black men in front of the courthouse.
Hall: In Montgomery County there are still some deep lines of prejudice. In my mind, I’m convinced that if this had have been a 17-18 year old white boy that had shot and killed a black maid or a black domestic worker, they never would have sought the death penalty to begin with.
Speers: Basically, he was just a bad guy. That’s what the bottom line was.There are some people who are so bad and just generally pose such a threat to the community that they need to be removed.
Hall: Knowing Glenn McGinniss and his background and all the circumstances, I don’t think that this was a proper application of the death penalty.
Earli: He’s not a violent person. He never has been a violent person. He’s very humble, a very likeable person.
Music
Jones: At his trial Glenn McGinniss never spoke in his own defence.
Never gave the white jurors a glimpse of a life far removed from their own. And so remained for many, a mute symbol of what they most fear.
Hall: When you get to know Glenn, I don’t think is a killer at heart.
Speers: Glen McGinniss never gave any statements to the police explaining his version of what happened, didn’t testify at his own trial to explain his very of what happened.
Jones: Glen McGinniss might have decided to lock away his secrets in Death Row, perhaps take them with him to the execution chamber.
His friend on the Row, Kenneth Harris, once he got his stay of execution, decided it was too risky to talk to us after all.
But McGinniss opened himself up completely.
McGinniss: Sometimes I can think clear about the whole incident. I can think about the whole situation that led me up to being here.
Jones: He was staying with his aunt at Conroe at the time of the killing. That morning, he says, he found letters to her from his mother, who was in jail.
McGinniss: She was begging for money. She was putting in little money slips, telling them, “Will you please send me some money when I can live and get some food and everything.”
Jones: He says it was those letters that drove him to do the robbery.
McGinniss: I started seeing everything over and over again. I can see the scene. I can tell you what I did. I can show you how I did it. Tell you step by step.
McGinniss: You scared already when you walk through the door unless you’re someone that does it for a living, you’re a paid assassin, you work for the CIA. You do everything fast speed.
Music
McGinniss: The hollering and the panic and the freaking out and everything taking place all at one time. Circumstances take you so fast into her, right. The incident just pretty much happened.
McGinniss: She went to the back room, she just started hollering. So I just shot her like that there.
FX: Gunshots
McGinniss: The gun that I had was like — I don’t know how to describe it — it was just a little old biddy gun. 25 calibre automatic gun, just a little old biddy gun.
Jones: What did you see when you looked at those photos?
McGinniss: Me. Just in a sense me. Because, in a sense, I thought I was pretty much dead in a lot of ways. I didn’t see me laying down there. But I seen me taking her life like that.
McGinniss: I can actually speak for myself when I say you get caught up in traps of yourself and you don’t know. Because you don’t know yourself.
Music
McGinniss: I seen people been here six, seven years. And you think the longer you live the longer your chances are of getting off Death Row. The longer time goes by you think you might have a chance. They ain’t killed me yet. They might not kill me, right?
I don’t know about if I’ll ever make it out of Death Row. I really don’t know.
Music
Jones: We’d come to Huntsville’s Death Row to meet two young black men.
There are more executions here than anywhere in America.
Nineteen last year alone.
The execution chamber is being prepared for one of the men we’re here to see.
His name is Kenneth Harris.
In 1988 he was convicted of the rape and murder of a young white woman. He says he’ll speak to us the day before he’s killed.
The other man is Glenn McGinniss. He was convicted in 1992 for the shooting death of a white woman in a robbery.
McGinniss is waiting for a death date while his lawyers file appeals.
McGinniss: Recently, everybody coming through is really black. I mean, and it’s not so much being black, it’s the age group that we’re coming off in here. I mean we’re looking at fellows — I mean look at me — we spend the majority of our lives locked up, or what you, until they take us down there to do what they want to do.
Nunnelee: These eight cells is what remains of the original Death Row. It is now used as a holding area for the inmates who are scheduled for execution. They have a bed, a toilet and sink.
Jones: So this is now the death house?
Nunnelee: This is the Texas death house, yes. We presently have 8 cells here, but we only utilise one at a time. That’s the way we operate. We have had multiple executions in the past, but never have more than one individual here at a time.
Nunnelee: This is the execution chamber itself, which houses the gurney. At the appointed hour the inmate is removed from his cell by a team of officers and led in here and asked to get on the gurney.
McGinniss: They strap you to the table. Before they strap you to the table, a microphone is supposed to come down. Once you’re laying down like this here, what happens is they get you and they ask you do you have anything to add. And they tie a bag up into your rectum area or what have you, to keep you from running on yourself or what have you.
Nunnelee: He is strapped down. First at the ankles. He’ll also be strapped at the legs, at the waist, and across his chest. Lastly he’s wrists are inserted through these straps. At that time the execution team will enter the room, and insert needles in each arm.
McGinniss: You know you’re going down there and you’re going to be strapped to the table. They’re going to put a needle in your arm, but you don’t know what the actuality is going to be. And I really don’t want to know.
Jones; And at that point I think it is, the witnesses are able to come into these rooms here?
Nunnelee: Correct. Once the saline solution is flowing.
Jones: And what happens then?
Nunnelee: Once the witnesses are in place, the inmate is asked by the warden, who is standing at his head, if he has any last statement to make. We’ve had, on one occasion, an inmate actually confess his crime on the gurney. That’s happened once out of 106 executions.
McGinniss: We’re told that they have the victims family over here in this booth right here. I’ve never been there, so I couldn’t really tell you in great detail how things are set up.
Nunnelee: We have medical technicians perform the execution. There are three drugs involved.
McGinniss: They way they make it seem is you’re going to Hotel Heaven right.
Nunnelee: One being sodium Thiapenthol, which is similar to what you might get at a dentist’s office to put you under.
McGinniss: I don’t know nobody who came back and told me how it was.
Nunnelee: The second is a muscle relaxant that opens the diaphragm for the Potassium Chloride which stops the heart.
McGinniss: They say it’s like 8 minutes before the actuality of the death takes place.
Nunnelee: The reaction generally is a heaving of the chest and a gasping sound as the air leaves the lungs.
Jones: When you were arrested, how old were you?
McGinniss: Seventeen. And I’d been incarcerated practically five years prior to that. In some shape or form in and out, in and out.
Music
Jones: 2am in one of Houston’s black wards.
These are the streets on which both Glenn McGinniss and Kenneth Harris grew up.
Crack houses are scattered through the neighbourhood.
FX: Police siren.
Jones: This is a regular haunt of crack smokers. They buy from the boys in the street and come here.
The officer knows this young woman well. He’s arrested her before for possession of crack cocaine.
The drug also wove its way through the lives of both Harris and McGinniss.
As a young boy, Glenn McGinniss watched his mother, Sadie, become addicted, and destroy her life.
McGinniss: Oh, it tears you up inside. It makes you lazy, it makes you want to not eat anything no more, because once the stuff get off inside you, you’re walking around — If I could just give her a hamburger maybe she could gain some weight. It takes you from being this big, it draws you up and then you stop wanting to take care of your hair and you stop caring about your little face. It just seem like you don’t care no more.
Earli: He would know his mother was off into drugs and he would beg her not to use the drugs, because he hated drugs. As a matter of fact, he didn’t even smoke.
McGinniss: She would always say, I’m going to beat this thing, mac, and then me and you are going to be a family again. And I’m like ‘Yeah.’
Jones: As his mother’s life fell apart, the only member of his family Glenn McGinniss could rely on was his paternal grandmother, Earli Mae Brown.
Earli keeps the only photos taken of him as a child.
Earli: This is a photo of him when he’s a baby. He’s about a year old here. Fat little guy, isn’t he?
And this is him when he was in like the second grade. He was like 7 years old in this one. And this is one that I had made. Someone took that picture in the house. I didn’t even know Glenn was behind me. I had this one taken of him in prison.
Earli: He started getting into trouble when he was about 11 or 12 years old. He started taking things from people. I’d say he used to do this because he was lonesome. He wanted attention. Glenn Senior kind of like abandoned him. You know he wasn’t around when Glenn Junior needed him.
Glenn Senior: I tried to get him to stay with me after I got married, but his mother, she thought that if he stayed with me, that would mess up her welfare cheque, so she decided against it.
Jones: It was at this time, when Glenn was about 9 years old, that he was sexually abused by his mother’s boyfriend.
McGinniss: I called the police, because they were doing drugs in the house. So I guess I pretty much brought a lot of things on myself.
Jones: What did he do to you, though?
McGinniss: He raped me. Just sexually raped me.
I couldn’t stop myself from bleeding in the back and everything. I put toilet paper down there and everything, but it wouldn’t stop. My mum had some tampons, wrapped them all up in my underwear. Got my underwear, and tied a knot around my underwear like this here, and put on my favourite Lee jeans and went to school.
Delores: Drugs, drugs is terrible. A five year old can sell you some crack, which they have done, because they’re not going to arrest a small child.
Jones: Delores Hazen is the mother of Kenneth Harris. She says crack has destroyed a whole generation of poor blacks — her son’s generation.
Delores: We’ve lost a whole generation of children behind drugs. Everything that’s in prison, in Death Row they are from the ages of 25 to 34 years old. We’ve lost them peoples.
Jones: It’s a national phenomenon. It’s crowded prisons with young black men. Though blacks are only 12% of the American population, almost half of all prisoners are black — 800,000 of them.
That’s reflected in Death Row’s statistics, where 41% of inmates are black. And where blacks murdering whites are much more likely to be executed.
The young Kenneth Harris was no stranger to the drug scene, nor to other temptations.
Delores: His first child was born when he was 13.
Jones: How many children does Kenneth have?
Delores: Six children. Kenneth got four boys and two girls.
Jones: That’s a lot.
Delores: What can I say.
Jones: So how many mothers for those six children?
Delores: Six.
Jones: Doctors have estimated Harris’s IQ as between 55 and 70, and testified that he’s mentally retarded. But at the time of the murder, he was also addicted to crack.
Delores: He wouldn’t do harm to nobody. But drugs did a whole lot. Drugs will cause you to do a whole lot of things. I’ve seen this.
Jones: And Delores has seen it happen again. These are her grandchildren. Their mother, her daughter, was also a crack addict. She’s in jail now because Delores put her there, she says, to save her life.
Delores: She’s straight now. I watched my daughter go from 230 pounds to 98 pounds. I watched her almost die, high on drugs.
Jones: These people in particular, have no sympathy for murderers on Death Row, no matter what life circumstances might have led them to violence.
Jones: They are the families of murder victims. They argue powerfully against mercy for the killers.
Bob: They have to be removed from society like a rabid dog so that they don’t infect the rest of the population.
Mrs Kelly: When these people murder our children, they put us into their lives.
Jones: Mrs Linda Kelly was the first family member of a victim to witness an execution in Texas.
Mrs Kelly: I recommend people watching it. It’s lethal injection, it’s not a morbid thing. It’s nothing compared to the crime they commit. My 90 year old mother in law was there and witnessed it. And she’s a devout Catholic and she was glad that she was there. I do recommend it if someone gets the opportunity that they take it. Because that the only way they’re going to have closure and peace of mind as to what happened.
Jones: Just 48 hours before her son was due to die, Delores Hazen got the news that Kenneth Harris had been given a stay of execution.
Delores: I told Kenneth when I left, I said “Hey, keep faith. Don’t give up.”
Jones: The judge told Harris’s jury to ignore his crack addiction at the time of the murder. Now the appeal court must decide if that was a mistake.
Delores: It’s wonderful. I knew this was going to happen, because I believe in god. I never did give up faith.
Mrs Stonestreet: This is Lisa. She was 28 when she died. And she was a warm, wonderful, loving young lady. She graduated from high school with honours. She was at the top of her field as a legal secretary.
Delores: He was accused of murdering this legal secretary, Alicia Stonewall, whatever.
Mrs Stonestreet: The Lord kept impressing on us to forgive him. And when I made the decision it was just like the Lord taking a sheaf of wheat and burning it into my heart, where I could never go back on it again.
Delores: In America, it’s all about money. Any time it’s about black and white things, if a black man’s involved, he’s going to get the death penalty.
Mrs Stonestreet: The Scriptures say ‘If you take a life, you must lay your life down’ and I believe that.
Music
Jones: There’s a wide gap between black and white perceptions of justice.
A division as distinct as that between the races in Conroe, Texas — the small town where the 17 year old Glenn McGinniss was living, where he committed murder and where he was tried.
Earli: They had an all white jury, a Jim Crow town, white judge, white prosecuting attorney and white victim and a black defendant. So what kind of fair trial do you expect?
Jones: Bill Hall was Glenn McGinniss’s court appointed lawyer.
He’s a man with unusual hobbies.
Hall: Well they always swallow the fish head first...
Jones: And unconventional ideas for a town like Conroe, which was once famous for lynching black men in front of the courthouse.
Hall: In Montgomery County there are still some deep lines of prejudice. In my mind, I’m convinced that if this had have been a 17-18 year old white boy that had shot and killed a black maid or a black domestic worker, they never would have sought the death penalty to begin with.
Speers: Basically, he was just a bad guy. That’s what the bottom line was.There are some people who are so bad and just generally pose such a threat to the community that they need to be removed.
Hall: Knowing Glenn McGinniss and his background and all the circumstances, I don’t think that this was a proper application of the death penalty.
Earli: He’s not a violent person. He never has been a violent person. He’s very humble, a very likeable person.
Music
Jones: At his trial Glenn McGinniss never spoke in his own defence.
Never gave the white jurors a glimpse of a life far removed from their own. And so remained for many, a mute symbol of what they most fear.
Hall: When you get to know Glenn, I don’t think is a killer at heart.
Speers: Glen McGinniss never gave any statements to the police explaining his version of what happened, didn’t testify at his own trial to explain his very of what happened.
Jones: Glen McGinniss might have decided to lock away his secrets in Death Row, perhaps take them with him to the execution chamber.
His friend on the Row, Kenneth Harris, once he got his stay of execution, decided it was too risky to talk to us after all.
But McGinniss opened himself up completely.
McGinniss: Sometimes I can think clear about the whole incident. I can think about the whole situation that led me up to being here.
Jones: He was staying with his aunt at Conroe at the time of the killing. That morning, he says, he found letters to her from his mother, who was in jail.
McGinniss: She was begging for money. She was putting in little money slips, telling them, “Will you please send me some money when I can live and get some food and everything.”
Jones: He says it was those letters that drove him to do the robbery.
McGinniss: I started seeing everything over and over again. I can see the scene. I can tell you what I did. I can show you how I did it. Tell you step by step.
McGinniss: You scared already when you walk through the door unless you’re someone that does it for a living, you’re a paid assassin, you work for the CIA. You do everything fast speed.
Music
McGinniss: The hollering and the panic and the freaking out and everything taking place all at one time. Circumstances take you so fast into her, right. The incident just pretty much happened.
McGinniss: She went to the back room, she just started hollering. So I just shot her like that there.
FX: Gunshots
McGinniss: The gun that I had was like — I don’t know how to describe it — it was just a little old biddy gun. 25 calibre automatic gun, just a little old biddy gun.
Jones: What did you see when you looked at those photos?
McGinniss: Me. Just in a sense me. Because, in a sense, I thought I was pretty much dead in a lot of ways. I didn’t see me laying down there. But I seen me taking her life like that.
McGinniss: I can actually speak for myself when I say you get caught up in traps of yourself and you don’t know. Because you don’t know yourself.
Music
McGinniss: I seen people been here six, seven years. And you think the longer you live the longer your chances are of getting off Death Row. The longer time goes by you think you might have a chance. They ain’t killed me yet. They might not kill me, right?
I don’t know about if I’ll ever make it out of Death Row. I really don’t know.