Are You suprised ?

Voices from the Arctic

ABC Australia

Postproduction script

 

 

 

Precis

The Sámi people are indigenous to Europe, their traditional lands crossing from Russia's Kola Peninsula to the north of Scandinavia and into the Arctic Circle.

Surviving decades of assimilation and discrimination, the Sámi have fought to keep their culture alive.

They've also fought for elected representative bodies to be their voice to governments -known as Sámi Parliaments — models that could inspire our own 'Voice to Parliament'.

'We know what is good for us and we can speak for ourselves', says Stefan Mikaelsson, the former President of Sweden's Sámi Parliament. 'And we don't want…Swedish state officials to talk on our behalf.'

As Australia debates the merits and model of its own indigenous 'Voice to Parliament', reporter Lauren Day travels to Scandinavia to learn about the Sámi's experience.

In this stunningly beautiful film, the Foreign Correspondent crew travels for hours across the Arctic tundra to capture the Sámi's traditional way of life, filming the autumn reindeer corral ahead of the winter migration.

And the crew heads out on Norway's spectacular fjords with the Sea Sámi who traditionally rely on fish for their livelihood.

In Norway and Sweden, Day hears of the immense pressures on Sámi lands and waters from a new wave of 'green' development sweeping across the Arctic.

The Sámi Parliaments are fighting windfarms and major mine proposals to extract resources crucial for the green energy transition.

They're fearful the projects could disrupt reindeer migration and that tailings from a large-scale copper mine could contaminate the waters of a significant fjord.

'One of the strongest weapons in the struggle is the Sami Parliament', say Sea Sámi fisherman Torulf Olsen.

While there are limits to these Parliaments' powers – they don't have the right of veto or the power to make law – many feel they're a powerful weapon in the Sámis' fight to survive.

'If it should happen that the Sámi Parliament stopped existing, then I think it should be much worse for the Sámi people again', says reindeer herder, Nils Mathis Sara.

And Sara has some strong words for Australia:

'If there is someone feeling like they are not being heard then…you should aim for a system that can speak up for you, your group, such as we have here. This would be my advice.'

 

Episode teaser

Music

00:10

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: For thousands of years, the unforgiving Arctic landscape has been home to the indigenous Sámi people.

00:15

 

STEFAN MIKAELSSON: We are walking in the footsteps of our ancestors.

00:26

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: After centuries of forced assimilation and discrimination, the Scandinavian Sámi fought for a voice to represent them to government.

00:30

 

TORULF OLSEN: One of the strongest, weapon in this struggle is the Sámi parliament.

00:38

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: But it’s now facing its biggest challenge yet.

00:44

 

ANDREAS BJELLAND ERIKSEN: We need to be honest about the fact that we need to produce more renewable electricity.

00:47

 

MARTIN PHILLIPS: Everyone is moving into electric vehicles. and unless these sorts of projects are approved, this is just not going to happen. it's not going be able to transition.  

00:52

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Many Sámi fear the ‘green transition’ is putting their ancestral lands at risk.

01:01

 

SILJE KARINE MUOTKA: You could kind of call it green colonisation, and it's because those climate measures you're taking on behalf of the world population, unfortunately our future is ruined by those measures.

01:08

Super:
Lauren Day
Reporter

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Here in Scandinavia, the Sámi have had parliaments to represent their interests to government for decades. Now, as Australia prepares to vote for its own indigenous voice to parliament, I've come to see how they work. What does it mean for the Sámi to have a voice: is it loud enough to be heard over the demands for development and are governments really listening?

01:24

Title: Voices from the Arctic

Music

01:44

Drone shots over plains. Super:
Rensjön, Sweden

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: On a crisp Arctic morning, an awe-inspiring event is underway.

01:55

Reindeer

Reindeer are being gathered for the autumn corral – a chance for the herders to check their animals before the winter migration.

02:07

 

Music

02:20

Lauren greets Karin and children

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: "And who are you all? You’re Matilda? I'm Lauren. And what’s your name?

NEJLA: Nejla.

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: I'm Lauren. And you are…?

ERIK: Erik.

02:27

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Sámi reindeer herder Karin Kvarfordt Niia and her children are hiking up to the annual event and I've been invited to join them.

02:46

Karin and Lauren walk with children to reindeer

And how many animals are likely to be slaughtered today?

KARIN: I don’t know. I don’t think they’ll be too many because when they start rutting, getting ready to create the next generation, then their meat tastes really bad.

02:55

 

Music

03:19

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: The path we’re taking was forged by Karin's ancestors hundreds of years ago. Today, she walks in their footsteps, and her children in hers. 

03:22

 

KARIN: My family has been involved in reindeer husbandry since ancient times. The land we see is so much more than just the earth we see, the forests that grow. It's also a cultural landscape. This is an area that has been used for generations.

03:33

Karin and children with reindeer

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: After two hours, we arrive to the bells and grunts of a thousand reindeer. For the little children, it’s an important lesson in their history, and maybe their future.

04:04

 

KARIN: Reindeer husbandry is taught by the elder generation to the younger. It can’t be taught at school or home or at the kitchen table. They have to join in. They have to see and they have to try.

04:20

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Some reindeer are fitted with GPS trackers, a modern addition to an ancient livelihood. Others just get a check-up.

04:43

 

Have you found any of your animals?

KARIN: No, I haven’t.

04:51

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: It’s hard when they’re all mixed together?

KARIN: Yeah, it’s like a needle in a haystack. Mine could be over there while I'm over here. You have to keep looking and looking.

04:56

Herders remove antlers

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: A few are slaughtered, but this one is lucky, all he’s losing are his antlers.  Male reindeer usually drop their antlers naturally before winter, but if they’re castrated, they need a little help.

05:16

 

KARIN: Reindeer are not everything about Sámi culture, absolutely not, but they are a very important part of it.

05:39

Herding reindeer

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: or generations, Sámi reindeer herders followed their animals with the seasons across vast swathes of land living off their meat and skins. But today only around 10 percent of Sámi in Sweden are reindeer herders.

05:51

 

Music

06:06

 

KARIN: Sometimes I think I could be the last generation to herd reindeer and use the land and manage it for future generations, and that makes me terribly sad.

06:13

GFX Globe showing Sápmi

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: The Sámi call their ancestral land Sápmi. It stretches from Russia's Kola Peninsula across the borders to Finland, Sweden and Norway.

06:32

Reindeer grazing

Under Swedish law the Sámi have the right to use land and water for reindeer grazing. But as Sweden moves to reduce its carbon emissions, a wave of green development is sweeping across the Arctic.

KARIN: When the lands disappear, and start being used for something other than reindeer herding,

06:46

Wind farm turbines

the more intruded upon we become, the greater the risk of a cultural collapse.

07:06

Kiruna GVs

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: For centuries, the Swedish state suppressed Sámi language and culture but the Sámi fought to have their voice heard.

07:19

Sámi parliament office

The Sámi parliament was formed in 1993. Its head office is here in Kiruna in the shadow of the world's biggest underground iron ore mine. Despite its name, the parliament has no legislative power; it's an elected representative body which advises the Swedish government on Sámi issues, but it’s not truly independent from the state, it's overseen by a government ministry.

07:26

Karin interview at home

KARIN: The combination of being a Swedish state authority and an elected body is complicated. On one hand, they have to follow the rules set by the Swedish state and on the other, they should be a voice for the Sámi people.

07:54

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Sámi like Karin are frustrated over the limitations of the parliament. Until recently the government hasn’t been obliged to consult it, although that’s set to change with a new law that requires consultation on matters of 'special significance'.

08:18

Stefan walking in woods

STEFAN MIKAELSSON: I believe it will make a difference, but it's not enough and it will be needed to improve that, but I have thought it was a good development when it was presented.

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Stefan Mikaelsson is a member of the Sámi parliament and its former president.

08:35

 

He says the key issue is Sweden's refusal to ratify a UN convention that would compel the state to not only consult but do so with the goal of achieving consent.

08:53

Stefan interview

Why do you think Sweden hasn't ratified ILO 169? 

09:05

 

STEFAN MIKAELSSON:  Because they don't think indigenous peoples have the same human rights as other peoples. 

09:09

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: You think that's still the case in Sweden? 

STEFAN MIKAELSSON: Yes, that is still the case in Sweden. And they talk about the Sámi people but they never talk with the Sámi people.

09:17

Stefan walking in woods

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: He says the current wave of green development on Sámi lands is like nothing he’s ever seen.

09:27

 

STEFAN MIKAELSSON: It is a huge, huge threat. These decisions that comes from Swedish parliament and Swedish government never says, "After this it's enough." They can take anything they want at any time they want.

09:34

Karin fishing

Music

09:50

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: One of the proposals being fought by the Sámi parliament and Karin’s Sámi village is here in Vittangi.

09:57

Vittangi GVs

The surrounding forests are critical to reindeer grazing and a key migration area.  But they’re also home to Europe's biggest untapped deposit of graphite, an essential material needed for electric vehicle batteries.

10:04

Karin and others at mine site

Today, Karin is visiting the proposed mine site as part of a land and environment court hearing.

10:19

Karin addresses hearing

KARIN: This area we have in front of us is affected not only by transport but also dust, light, seismic activity and so on. We can clearly see a negative effect on reindeer husbandry.

10:28

Balloons float above tree line

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Balloons float above the tree line, marking out the planned site.

10:46

Talga group representatives at hearing

The company proposing the mine is the Australian-based Talga group. Chief Operating Officer Martin Phillips is keen to stress the billion dollar project’s value to the green transition.

10:54

 

MARTIN PHILLIPS: This is the highest grade of graphite.

11:09

Phillips 100%

It's an important part of the battery supply chain for Europe.

11:11

Onsite court hearing

 

11:16

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: While it waits for the court’s approval, the company has started test drilling.

11:19

 

MARTIN PHILLIPS: We operate in a way where we have been doing our exploration work in the summer, then leaving

11:23

Phillips 100%

and ensuring that the reindeer can come in the winter. So our relationship actually at the local level has been, I think, very good in order to communicate and engage.

11:30

Balloon floating above tree line

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Talga says that they have had good dialogue with the Sámi. What do you think?

11:42

 

KARIN: We've lost far too much land to too many companies. I see no possibility for us to back down.

11:51

Karin at hearing

So far, Talga has not presented anything that could make us change our opinion.

12:01

'Go back to down under' sign

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: If you are not given that informed consent from the Sámi villages here will you still proceed with digging?

12:10

Phillips 100%

MARTIN PHILLIPS: We'll still proceed with digging if the court gives us that permission to. We’re following due process and we are following all of the laws and the legislation that Sweden has laid out for us.

12:17

Driving along coast

Music

12:30

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: The inspiration for the Sámi parliament in Sweden came from across the border. The Sámi parliament in Norway

12:38

Lauren to  camera in car

is also fighting a wave of green development as the country strives to meet its ambitious climate targets. It’s shaping up to be the biggest battle since the parliament was formed more than 30 years ago.

12:45

Alta River GVs

The birth of the Sámi parliament in Norway had its origins here on the Alta River, an important place for wild salmon fishing and reindeer herding. In the late '60s the Norwegian government produced a plan to dam the river and build a massive hydroelectric power plant.

12:58

Colour. Archival.  Sámi village protest

The original proposal would flood the nearby Sámi village of Maze. The Sámi fought back.

13:20

 

Music

13:26

 

SILJE KARINE MUOTKA: It was hunger strikes, it was protesting by people physically trying to hamper the construction workers. They had formed a human blockade of some sort and it went on to the point where Norwegian government did send 600 police officers to Alta. It did go on for very many years, actually almost 20 years. It did evolve to become to be the largest civil disobedience case in Norway.

13:34

Silje walks in parliament

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Silje Karine Muotka was a little girl at the time of the Alta protests, but she remembers the shockwaves the movement created.

14:10

 

SILJE KARINE MUOTKA:  After 150 years of Norwegian-ization, which was a spoken politics to eradicate our culture and our language, it was hard, I guess even to try to think the thought on rioting. I think it was hard for people.

14:20

Aerials of dam

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: A scaled back version of the dam was eventually built in 1987, but the conflict would change the course of Silje Karine’s life and Sámi history.

SILJE KARINE MUOTKA: You could say that they didn’t win the battle, but it became clear for the Norwegian government that they needed a political body where the Sámi community voice could be heard.

14:43

Sámi parliament building

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Two years later the Sámi parliament in Norway was formed.

15:11

Silje in parliament

Today, Silje Karine is the president.

SILJE KARINE MUOTKA: We are a political elected body like any other political body elected body. We have our disagreements, but when a decision is made in this hall, the Sámi people has stated their opinion.

15:15

Nussir mountains/fiord

Music

15:35

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Now, Norway's Sámi parliament is facing a battle to protect these waters. The Nussir mountains surrounding this fjord contain the country’s biggest deposit of copper, another critical material needed to help power a green future.

15:43

 

SILJE KARINE MUOTKA: The plan is to release the tailings from the mining project into a fjord. And it is the national salmon fjord also.

15:58

Torulf on boat

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Torulf Olsen is a sea Sámi fisherman, whose livelihood and culture depends on the fjord.

TORULF OLSEN:  The connection to the water is in your blood.

16:10

 

You have to go to the sea, you have to see the sea, you have to feel the sea. Even if it's cold, you have to wash your hands in it, you have to wash your face in it. So, yes, it's a special culture.

16:20

Quarry at edge of fjord

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: This area has been mined before in the 1970s. Some of the infrastructure remains and is today being used as a quarry. 

16:34

Torulf interview on boat

Torulf remembers what happened to the fish the last time tailings were released into the Repparfjord.

TORULF OLSEN:  We couldn't eat the fish.

16:44

 

It was even like green inside. A lot of copper inside, it looks like a lot of copper inside. I tried to taste it, I can remember the taste. No, we had to go to meatballs after that.

16:51

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Ae you expecting that that will happen again with this new project?

TORULF OLSEN: Yeah. Their production will be approximately 10 times higher.

17:08

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: The company plans to pump around two million tonnes of tailings per year into the bottom of the fjord, but says they’ll be contained using new technology. Torulf is sceptical.

17:17

 

Where will the tailings be dumped?

TORULF OLSEN: Tailings will be just underneath us.

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Oh here? Wow! And what will be in the tailings?

TORULF OLSEN: Oh, the usual.

17:30

 

Heavy metals, poisoned heavy metals, and chemicals which are poison.

17:43

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: The Sámi parliament has been helping Torulf and other local Sámi fight the proposal.

TORULF OLSEN: One of the strongest weapon in the struggle is the Sámi parliament.

17:49

Houses on edge of fjord, men fishing

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: All the company needs now is a final building permit. The Sámi parliament was consulted about the mine, yet in spite of its opposition, the project was given the go-ahead.

SILJE KARINE MUOTKA:  You could kind of call it green colonialism, and it's because those climate

18:01

Silje interview

measures you're taking on behalf of the world population, unfortunately, our future is ruined by those measures.

18:19

Laruen walks on shore with Terje

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Local mayor Terje Wickstrom is also sea Sámi. He supports the mine and thinks the Sámi parliament should stop opposing it.

18:31

Terje interview

TERJE WICKSTROM: The Norwegian government has given the Nussir all the approvals and I find it quite hard that the Sámi parliament still is fighting against the project. I don't think it's democratic. I don't think it's right. We can't have just reindeers or fishing industry in this area. We have to have other industries. 

18:40

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: So you think Sámi culture can co-exist with mining and development like this?

19:03

 

TERJE WICKSTROM:  What we are now experiencing in our area for many years, that it would be worse for the culture if there's, if there would be less people here, less and less people.

19:09

Torulf on boat

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: For sea Sámi fishermen like Torulf Olsen, history makes it difficult to have faith in the Norwegian government.

19:26

Torulf interview

TORULF OLSEN: Yes, the money talks. The money talks, the money wins.

19:35

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: If your fears come true, what would happen to the Sámi fishermen here?

TORULF OLSEN: We disappear. We disappear from here, from this fjord.

19:39

 

We surrender. We surrender.

19:52

Drone shot. Fjord GV

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: It’s not just sea Sámi fishermen who are worried about what will happen if the Nussir copper mine goes ahead.

19:56

Lauren onto ATV

Reindeer herders whose animals graze in the area are also concerned. The Sámi reindeer herders are semi-nomadic, so I'm heading off into the mountains to meet one who’s already started his winter migration. hopefully I can find him.

20:04

Travelling to reindeer herder

Music

20:19

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: The vast landscape of Norway's Arctic tundra feels desolate and hostile to life, but it sustains the Sámi and their reindeer. In the depths of winter, temperatures can plummet to minus 40 degrees. Herders once used skis and sleds to migrate with their animals. Now it’s mostly snow mobiles and ATVS. Today, the all-terrain vehicle is living up to its name.

20:37

 

Music

21:07

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Finally we find the man we’ve come to see, reindeer herder Nils Mathis Sara.

21:11

Lauren greets Nils

 

21:17

Nils looks for reindeer with binoculars

NILS MATHIS: There in the forest. Can you see them?

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Are there reindeer over there? May I look?

NILS MATHIS: On this side of the lake. In the forest.

21:22

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Nils Mathis and his herd have just arrived here from his summer grazing land where the Nussir copper mine is planned. They’ll stay until the snow comes and the lakes freeze.

21:33

Nils and Lauren chopping wood

"It's harder than it looks."

21:50

 

NILS MATHIS: Be careful, we don’t have any Band-Aids.

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: .I don’t know if I'm cut out for this...

21:54

 

Ah, there we go.

22:01

Nils interview by campfire

Isn’t it a bit lonely at times here in the mountains?

NILS MATHIS: Oh no. No, it’s not. You’re working 24/7. And you have a lot of mates around. Reindeer are good mates, and you don’t get into arguments.

22:11

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: He says the last time they mined the area, his reindeer suffered.

22:31

 

NILS MATHIS: They drove these big vehicles up and down. All the time there was this dust hanging over the reindeer pasture. Later, the reindeer came into that area to feed. Then winter came and by springtime we saw the results. Lots of nice, well-fed reindeer that got pneumonia. They died.

22:37

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: You have to be resourceful to live in these mountains.

23:09

 

NILS MATHIS: Do you have a knife?

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: No, I don’t. But I have an axe.

NILS MATHIS: Oh yeah, you have an axe. Carve it with an axe.

23:13

Lauren eats reindeer

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Living sustainably off the land has allowed the Sámi to keep using it for centuries.

"Mm, delicious."

23:22

 

NILS MATHIS:  The green shift is not a green shift for us, it's more like a brown shift.

23:32

Reindeer

Personally, I don’t understand what they're talking about. It seems like everything will be destroyed and they call it a green shift.

23:42

Aerials. Reindeer

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Nils Mathis's herding district is considering legal action over the copper mine. In the meantime, he’s grateful the Sámi parliament is continuing to lobby the government and investors to try to stop it.

NILS MATHIS: Without the Sámi parliament it would’ve been even worse for us.

23:54

Nils interview

Since it got involved we now have some kind of  hope that it will work for us Sámi people.  

24:15

Norwegian Sámi parliament building/ Silje in parliament

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Unlike Sweden, the Sámi parliament in Norway is independent from government, and it receives double the funding. Norway has also ratified the UN convention which enshrines a right for the Sámi to be consulted.

24:27

 

SILJE KARINE MUOTKA:  We have achieved a lot of things,

24:44

Silje interview

because it is a possibility for us, of course, to organise our own processes, develop our own politics, and also do our own decisions. So this is a good thing.

24:47

Oslo GVs. Super:
Oslo, Norway

Music

24:59

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Norway - a country that built its wealth on oil and gas - is racing to go green. It’s hard to walk down the streets of Oslo without

25:08

Lauren to camera on Oslo street

seeing an electric car. It’s got the highest per capita electric vehicle ownership in the world and everything from the ferries to the trams run off the country’s renewable energy grid.

25:17

Lauren into Energy Ministry

I’ve come to the Ministry of Energy to see how the state is balancing its green goals with its commitment to indigenous rights. Andreas Bjelland Eriksen is the state secretary of Norway's energy ministry.

25:28

Andreas Bjelland Eriksen interview

Andreas Bjelland Eriksen is the state secretary of Norway's energy ministry.

25:39

 

ANDREAS BJELLAND ERIKSEN: We have a goal of reducing our national emissions by 50 to 55 percent by 2030, and then going to net zero in 2050.  We need, we need to be honest about the fact that we need to produce more renewable electricity. We need to utilise the possibilities that we can, but we need to do it in a way that respects indigenous rights

25:46

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: The president of the Sámi parliament has calls it green colonialism. Is it green colonialism?

26:09

 

ANDREAS BJELLAND ERIKSEN: From our point of view, the important thing now is to work as close together as possible with the reindeer herders, with the Sámi people, to be able to find the framework that can last over time, that can be a good framework, that also takes into account the rights of the Sámi people. And that is our goal right now.

26:13

Wind turbines, mines

SILJE KARINE MUOTKA: The green transition must be a just transition. I feel that it is really important that we safeguard human rights and that is a just transition.

26:41

Silje interview

You can't choose solutions that, for us, it gives us no hope for a future.

26:53

Karin overlooking town

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: In Sweden, Karin Kvarfordt Niia wishes her Sámi parliament had a more powerful voice.

KARIN: We are a people who are used to fighting, Since the colonisation of Sápmi began, we have been battling and fighting.

27:00

 

It’s like it’s in our DNA. All we want is to use the land and continue herding reindeer. To live our lives. So yes, I am tired of fighting but there’s no alternative. There’s no one else to fight for us.

27:22

Nils singing

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: Across the border, Nils Mathis Sara honours his land through song. Temperatures on the tundra will soon plummet and the Arctic nights will get longer. His greatest hope is that the parliament that represents his voice to those in power will be heard.

27:44

 

NILS MATHIS SARA: For us in Norway, or in the Nordic countries, if the Sámi parliament ceased to exist then I think it would be much worse for the Sámi people.

28:10

 

LAUREN DAY, Reporter: And he has some advice from the Arctic to Australia.

28:22

Nils

NILS MATHIS SARA: If people feel they're not being heard, you should aim for a system that can speak up for you and your group, like we have here. That would be my advice.

28:26

Credits [see below]

Music

28:46

Out point

 

29:26

 

CREDITS:

 

REPORTER
Lauren Day

 

PRODUCER
Anne Worthington

 

CAMERA
Greg Nelson ACS

 

EDITOR
Peter O'Donoghue

 

FIXERS
Anna Sunna
Roger Manndal

 

MUSIC
Máze by ISÁK
Sparkling Creek by Vajas, Ánde Somby

 

ARCHIVE
NRK

 

ASSISTANT EDITOR
Tom Carr

 

GRAPHICS
Andrés Gómez Isaza

 

ARCHIVAL RESEARCH
Michelle Boukheris

 

SENIOR PRODUCTION MANAGER
Michelle Roberts

 

PRODUCTION CO-ORDINATOR
Victoria Allen

 

DIGITAL PRODUCER
Matt Henry

 

SUPERVISING PRODUCER
Lisa McGregor

 

EXECUTIVE PRODUCER
Morag Ramsay

 


foreign correspondent
abc.net.au/foreign

 

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