The
Journey Home
With the massacre of UN workers on September
6, West Timor appears to be sliding into lawlessness. More than 100,000 East
Timorese languish in squalid refugee camps, hostage to the militiamen.
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Reporter: Liz Jackson
Producer: Anne Connolly
LIZ JACKSON: In the late afternoon of
the 8th of September, a United Nations helicopter flies into Dili, the capital
of East Timor.
It's bearing the bodies of three
United Nations High Commission for Refugees workers murdered by militias at the
UNHCR compound in the West Timorese town of Atambua.
The state of the bodies is such that
the UN is unable to tell which body is in which coffin.
ALIAS BIN AHMED: HEAD OF UNHCR,
ATAMBUA: Their bodies were dragged and burnt, dragged out of the office in the
compound in front of the office and they were burnt.
One was shot, one was beheaded, and
one was disembowelled, yeah.
LIZ JACKSON: The horrific nature of
the attack has at last refocused the world's attention on the militias and the
East Timorese refugees they still hold hostage.
SERGIO VIEIRA DE MELLO, HEAD OF UN
MISSION, EAST TIMOR: This is just too much, and my hope is that it will lead to
decisive action against this cancer called the militia.
It's about time that we address it at
the root, and treat them for what they are -- killers and nothing but killers.
LIZ JACKSON: But for the time being,
the UN has pulled out completely, leaving 100,000 East Timorese refugees behind
in the squalid camps in West Timor, in the hands of the very militia whose acts
of terror last year forced them to leave.
It's just what the militia wanted.
Four Corners was in Timor as these
events unfolded, on the last refugee boat out of West Timor, before the UN
operation ceased, on the last journey home.
LIZ JACKSON, AUGUST 31, 2000: It's
six days before the killing of the UN workers.
We arrange to take the boat from the
capital of East Timor, Dili, to the capital of West Timor, Kupang, still part
of Indonesia.
We're going to collect around 200
refugees still held hostage in the camps in West Timor, a year after East Timor
voted overwhelmingly for independence.
All the roads leading to the border
are blocked by the militias, so this boat is their only way out.
It's an overnight trip from Dili to
Kupang, 150 nautical miles.
The captain has received a radio
message warning him that the day before, hundreds of militia have fired shots
and stoned the parliament building in Kupang.
His head office in Manila is worried.
BOAT CAPTAIN: Well, we receive
information this morning from our office in Manila that the crew are not
allowed to go ashore tomorrow because of this trouble.
LIZ JACKSON: Because the militia will
come to the port and try to make trouble?
BOAT CAPTAIN: That's right, yeah,
that's what we heard from them.
LIZ JACKSON: Next morning, the port
is quiet.
There's no sign of trouble.
Jake Morland from the UN High
Commission for Refugees is already down at the wharf.
How many refugees are coming on
today?
JAKE MORLAND, UNHCR, KUPANG: 200.
LIZ JACKSON: Is that more than you
were expecting?
JAKE MORLAND: A little bit more, but
even so, normally we take about 500, 600 --
LIZ JACKSON: The refugees arrive in
buses from the transit centre, where they have spent the last week waiting for
the boat behind armed guards.
As they unload their possessions, the
Indonesian military, the TNI, are watching.
It's their job to provide the
security for those who want to return.
The militia have made it clear, many
times before, that they'll take the law into their own hands to stop
repatriation.
JAKE MORLAND: Repatriation is
normally the target for violence, along with food distribution.
We have had incidents down here at
the port with UNHCR workers, IOM workers, being threatened, people coming up to
them and doing this --
So this is the sort of thing --
intimidation, threats, sometimes physical violence --
Refugees are often pulled off the
bus, they are beaten up in front with the TNI standing by, watching.
Humanitarian workers are told to step
aside.
There's not much we can do.
We are not soldiers.
We can tell people to stop but in the
end, we are not the bosses here.
We're not 100 per cent in control.
LIZ JACKSON: The UNHCR is worried
that there's more trouble coming soon, because in a few days time, it will be
the anniversary of the announcement of the referendum results.
JAKE MORLAND: The militia are very
sensitive about this.
And they want East Timor back.
LIZ JACKSON: So do you expect more
incidents over the next two weeks?
JAKE MORLAND: We expect the situation
to get worse before it gets better.
LIZ JACKSON: What sort of incidents?
JAKE MORLAND: The situation is
unpredictable.
LIZ JACKSON: The flood of refugees
back from west to east has in recent months slowed to a trickle.
Many have been intimidated, some are
ambivalent, some committed crimes in the violence last year and are unsure what
that will mean for them when they return.
Only a handful have managed to make
it from the border town of Atambua, 350km away.
JAKE MORLAND: These people have
travelled throughout the night to get here.
They are too frightened to tell their
friends and families they're leaving, because they're afraid that the militia
will find out, or other groups in the camps.
Many of them have been held virtually
captive in these camps.
It's not an easy decision to decide
to return.
They don't receive accurate enough
information about what's going on in East Timor.
So these are brave people but they're
very frightened people.
LIZ JACKSON: The UNHCR doesn't know
precisely how many people are still left in the camps.
They work with a figure of 120,000,
of whom they reckon 70 per cent to 80 per cent want to go home.
They tried to do a register earlier
this year, but were prevented by the militia, who use the refugees as a source
of income.
JAKE MORLAND: They did not want us to
have a credible figure on refugees.
Maybe they know that the figure that
we use now is inflated.
LIZ JACKSON: They inflate the figures
so they can cream off money from the aid that's provided to help the refugees?
JAKE MORLAND: Exactly, exactly.
LIZ JACKSON: It's early afternoon by
the time everyone is loaded on and the boat is on its way.
It's been a long wait for the many
who fled East Timor a year ago to escape the violence that erupted when the
referendum result was announced.
"LORENCO": I left East
Timor because our houses had all been burnt down.
If we refused to leave our houses, we
were threatened by the militia.
They said, "Get out.
If you don't leave, we'll kill you
all."
So we left our homes and they set
fire to them with petrol.
LIZ JACKSON: Julio Fernandas was one
of the men who burnt down the houses.
He was an East Timorese member of the
Indonesian Army, the TNI.
JULIO FERNANDAS: As a soldier who had
long served my country and my people, I had commanding officers who gave me
orders.
But I don't mean that I looted or
murdered or stole people's things because I didn't, but myself and some others,
including militiamen, carried out a scorched earth operation, burning down
around 9 or 10 houses.
LIZ JACKSON: Julio was then ordered
by his Indonesian commanders to move to West Timor.
He was told it would just be a
temporary stay.
11 months later, he knows that's a
lie.
JULIO FERNANDAS: So I've decided that
even though I feel that I've done wrong, I should go back because it's the land
of my birth.
If I stay here, nothing will change.
LIZ JACKSON: When Julio said he
wanted to return to East Timor, he was discharged from the army, but leaving the
camp wasn't so easy -- he was threatened by the militia.
JULIO FERNANDAS: The militia are
really brutal.
They want to take back East Timor.
They want to go to war there, they
say.
"Go ahead," I say, but I
won't be involved.
I'm a civilian now, not a soldier.
I've been discharged.
I don't get paid anymore, I don't get
rations.
I've returned to society.
I'm going to tend my garden or go
fishing.
It's up to me.
LIZ JACKSON: Julio is happy to name
the people behind the campaign to stop the refugees leaving the camps --
militia leaders Eurico Guterres and Joao Tavares.
JULIO FERNANDAS: Eurico and Tavares.
Tavares is the commander and Eurico
is his deputy.
They've still got lots of followers
and lots of weapons.
Lots of weapons.
More than the TNI.
LIZ JACKSON: It's been hard for the
refugees to find out what it's like back in East Timor.
The militia have been spreading
rumours that there was a famine, women who returned were raped, and men were
killed.
Joaquim is a farmer, and he's now
going back, with 30 members of his family.
"JOAQUIM": We wanted to go
back for a very long time but we heard rumours that some of the refugees who
went back had been killed.
Some were detained, some had their
things stolen, so only since we've exchanged information are we willing to go
back.
LIZ JACKSON: Joaquim tells us why he
thinks the militia have been running a disinformation campaign.
"JOAQUIM": They want to
keep people here in order to keep the pro-autonomy movement alive.
They don't want people being told to
go back but the people here can't stand it anymore.
LIZ JACKSON: Joaquim's family has
been living in a camp near Kupang with 12,000 other refugees.
It's been the hardship of life in the
camp that has pushed them to leave, and the shortage of food.
"JOAQUIM": People have been
starving, many have died of starvation.
We're human beings.
We're not trees or stones.
Human beings need to eat and drink.
If we were trees or stones, we could
grow by ourselves.
We've been here a year and we don't
have any land, we don't have anything.
That's how we feel and we want to go
home, because the situation is, whether we live or die, we want to go home.
LIZ JACKSON: Next morning, as we pull
into Dili, the refugees are sporting sunshades that acknowledge the Hong
Kong-based billionaire who provides the boat for their repatriation, property
developer Eric Hutong.
There's no-one here to welcome the
200 refugees, except peacekeepers, aid workers and the UN High Commission for
Refugees.
As they load onto the buses, some of
them are worried about what sort of reception they'll receive back home.
Julio is returning to the same
village where he burnt down his neighbours' houses.
JULIO FERNANDAS: Of course I'm still
worried.
Why?
Because we Timorese hold grudges for
a very long time.
Perhaps for 10 or 20 years or for 7
generations.
That's the difficult thing.
But I'll go back.
LIZ JACKSON: The bus is guarded by
peacekeepers because the harsh reality is that having finally escaped the
militia camps, the returnees now face suspicion and hostility back in East
Timor for staying away so long.
BERNARD KERBLAT, CHIEF OF OPERATIONS,
UNHCR, EAST TIMOR: Rightly or wrongly -- rather wrongly in our perception --
most of the returnees who have returned, let's say after February, are
'perceived' by the general population as, "Ah, they are the pro-autonomy
party."
LIZ JACKSON: One year after the
referendum, it's a sensitive time to come to terms with accepting back
pro-autonomy supporters.
All around East Timor, people are lighting
candles to remember, a year to the day, friends and family who were slaughtered
by the pro-autonomy militia.
In the town of Suai, near the border
with West Timor, thousands of people are making their way to the grounds of the
half-built cathedral, where 183 men, women and children were massacred.
Families had gone to the church
believing that there, they would be safe.
The three local priests were also
shot and hacked to death.
The circle of stones marks the place
where the militia piled up the bodies and burnt them.
Each stone is a memorial to a life
that was taken.
Domingas dos Santos, a cook for the
priests, lost her 16-year-old daughter and her 11-year-old son.
DOMINGAS DOS SANTOS: My son was
killed in front of my eyes.
He was shot dead.
A man named Egidio shot my son and he
also killed the priests.
This is not a story I heard from
someone else, I saw this with my own eyes.
The militia ordered us to come out
and he took my daughter and said in Indonesian, "This is my wife".
Then he put a necklace around my
daughter's neck.
LIZ JACKSON (To interpreter): Does
she know what happened with her daughter, what they did to her daughter?
DOMINGAS DOS SANTOS: She was taken to
Raihenek, it's a militia compound in Atambua.
She wrote that she wants to come
back, but the militia man won't let her.
She thinks a lot about it now because
she's pregnant, she's six months pregnant.
LIZ JACKSON: The message from the
church is forgiveness and reconciliation, but many of these people want the
perpetrators tried and punished.
They want justice.
DOMINGAS DOS SANTOS: Justice should
be done.
We, the Timorese women, are not
curtain rags to wipe the floor.
We are not curtain rags.
LIZ JACKSON: Not a single person has
been brought to trial for the atrocities committed a year ago, and that's the
way the militia leaders want to keep it.
Now based in West Timor, they want an
amnesty for their crimes.
One of the most high-profile is
Eurico Guterres, seen here in West Timor four weeks ago, leading his militia on
their way to attack the parliament building in Kupang.
JOSE RAMOS HORTA, INDEPENDENCE
LEADER: Eurico is a confessed war criminal.
We just go back to the videos where
he boasted, where he instigated right in front of the cameras and thousands of
people, to kill anyone who oppose integration with Indonesia.
LIZ JACKSON: We discover, however,
that in the name of reconciliation, these militiamen have been invited to
discussions authorised by the East Timorese leadership.
They've been discussing a quid pro
quo that would amount to giving the militia leaders a partial amnesty for their
crimes if they let the refugees go home.
Francisco Guterres is the secretary
of the Commission for Reconciliation, set up by the leadership of East Timor,
Xanana Gusmao and Jose Ramos Horta.
Francisco tells us about a series of
meetings between militia representatives and the Commission in Singapore,
Denpasar and most recently, in August, in Washington.
LIZ JACKSON: Were the militia leaders
asking for an amnesty for all the militia leaders in West Timor?
FRANCISCO GUTERRES, COMMISSION FOR
RECONCILIATION: Yes.
This is the message that we got in
Washington.
LIZ JACKSON: And your offer, the
middle ground, the partial amnesty, would that apply to all the militia leaders
in West Timor?
FRANCISCO GUTERRES: Yes, definitely
yes.
We didn't have an agreement at the
time, but we tried to set up another meeting to discuss very deeply this middle
ground position.
LIZ JACKSON: Francisco says Eurico
Guterres was invited to Washington but Eurico was worried if he left Indonesia,
he'd be arrested for war crimes.
LIZ JACKSON: Do you think you could
offer someone like Eurico Guterres some sort of leniency if he comes back?
FRANCISCO GUTERRES: It's very hard to
predict, to say, but I think when we come into a deeper negotiation and try to
have our negotiation in closed doors, and we try to speak heart-to-heart, I
think something could be possible.
LIZ JACKSON: You think you could
probably find some sort of arrangement that would suit him?
FRANCISCO GUTERRES: Yes, I hope that
maybe we try to look at this situation, we try to set up this special meeting.
But it depends on them.
If they're happy, if they'd like it
to happen, then we'll be happy with that.
LIZ JACKSON: Did you report back on
that meeting and the discussions to Jose Ramos Horta or Xanana Gusmao?
FRANCISCO GUTERRES: Yes, we reported
it --
Every meeting that we had, when we
come back, we always report it to them.
LIZ JACKSON: East Timor's
President-in-waiting, Xanana Gusmao, ducks all questions about these talks.
LIZ JACKSON: Is the leadership in
East Timor involved in talking with militia leaders, negotiating with militia
leaders to see if some deal can be done in terms of leniency, so that they will
assist the return of the refugees?
XANANA GUSMAO, INDEPENDENCE LEADER:
There are so many, many talks that we are bored with talks.
LIZ JACKSON: But are those talks
happening?
Leniency in exchange for assisting
the refugees?
XANANA GUSMAO: Talks in Tokyo, talks
in Singapore, talks in Bali, talks in Kupang, talks everywhere.
And we cannot live with talks.
LIZ JACKSON: I just want to get
clear, just for the record.
Are there talks happening with
militia leaders like Eurico Guterres, talks about the possibilities of leniency
if they can assist in bringing back the thousands of refugees that they are
controlling in the camps of West Timor?
Is that sort of a deal being talked
about now?
XANANA GUSMAO: I didn't yet hear
about this.
Maybe -- maybe.
LIZ JACKSON: Are you having talks
with the militia leaders about those kinds of demands?
JOSE RAMOS HORTA: There were informal
talks or sporadic talks in different places, in Kupang itself, in Denpasar.
A few months ago, there were talks
with them and with Falantil in Singapore.
But these people do not have a
political agenda.
They're common criminals -- rapists,
arsonists, mass murderers.
And any talk with them, as we've had,
we have bent backwards --
In normal circumstances, I would
never authorise someone from my organisation to talk with such a common
criminal.
But we bent backwards.
We say, "Yes, let's go and talk
with them."
And what is the result?
Absolutely nothing in terms of their
behaviour.
They continue to terrorise the
refugees in the camps, they continue to infiltrate into East Timor, with the
help of the TNI, the Indonesian army, in order to destabilise the territory.
LIZ JACKSON: Down at the border, the
UN peacekeepers are on high alert but it's well nigh impossible to stop militia
infiltrations.
In recent months, these soldiers have
lost two colleagues -- a New Zealander and a Nepalese peacekeeper killed in gun
battles with the militia.
Francisco believes that the recent
border violence is the militia's way of putting on pressure to get a better
deal out of the reconciliation talks.
His evidence is a phone call he
received from Eurico Guterres.
LIZ JACKSON: Do you think that the
recent violence and incidents on the border are connected with the militia
leaders' wanting a better deal from you at the next meeting?
FRANCISCO GUTERRES: Yes, yes, because
before this violence happened, I got a phone call from two militia leaders, and
they put the pressure that 'if we don't meet Xanana, we create more violence in
the border'.
LIZ JACKSON: Can you tell us the name
of the militia leaders who rang you with that threat?
FRANCISCO GUTERRES: It was Joenico --
I think it was Joenico -- and Eurico Guterres.
LIZ JACKSON: On the anniversary of
the Suai massacre, September 6, the militia strikes again, this time not at UN
peacekeepers, but at UN aid workers in the West Timorese border town of
Atambua.
This is the UN High Commission for
Refugees compound after the attack, which left three of their international
workers dead.
On that morning, a large
demonstration had been marching through the streets of Atambua.
At around 12 o'clock, a group of
militiamen on motorbikes at the head of the procession, broke away.
The compound was guarded by eight
Indonesian policemen.
Alias Bin Ahmed was inside the UN
compound.
ALIAS BIN AHMED, HEAD OF UNHCR,
ATAMBUA: What I saw from where I was, this group of motorcyclists were passing
by.
A few start stopping and shouting,
then more pass, and more and more coming in, and the police did not actually
take firm action to stop them from coming.
LIZ JACKSON: Did they try to stop
them at all?
ALIAS BIN AHMED: Just showing, you
know --
And they just brushed them aside and
passed them aside and came in -- two, three, four, five start coming in, and by
the time they were in the compound, about 25, we heard broken glasses, stones
being thrown.
Then we start jumping over the wall.
JESSIE PONCE, FIELD OFFICER, UNHCR,
ATAMBUA: They had long hair, some of them with machetes and knives, I saw some
guns --
Some of them were still wearing their
helmets.
They were shouting.
But I think --
I saw one guy start throwing stones
and the rest followed.
That's when I ran off the window.
LIZ JACKSON: And their faces?
JESSIE PONCE: Faces, uh -- the usual,
typical face of militia -- long hair, dirty looking, bloodshot eyes --
LIZ JACKSON: Jessie Ponce was the
last worker to escape the compound alive.
As his wounds were being treated in a
nearby hospital, he could hear his trapped colleagues calling for help on their
two-way radios, an hour after the militia raid had started.
JESSIE PONCE: I was monitoring the
radio, I still had my radio.
They were already cleaning my wounds.
I had one stab wound here.
I only found out later that I also
got stabbed in the knee.
But they were cleaning my wound, I
was monitoring the radio.
I heard the call for help of Carlos,
one of the guys who got killed.
He said, "We're still waiting
for help here.
Come and help, please, please --
" and all this.
ALIAS BIN AHMED: Five of us hid in
the vicinity, and after three and a half hours, we felt that it was safe enough
and we came out, only to find out three of our colleagues were killed inside
the office.
Their bodies were dragged and burnt,
dragged out of the office in the compound, in front of the office, and they were
burnt.
Their remains to be brought back
today, yeah.
Uh -- it's obvious that they're
hell-bent on destroying and killing people.
It's premeditated, there's no doubt
about that.
Why?
Why us?
JESSIE PONCE: It's a very, very
tragic moment for all of us.
LIZ JACKSON: How old were the workers
who were killed?
ALIAS BIN AHMED: Samson Aregahegn is
Ethiopian.
He's in his mid-40s.
Carlos Caceres is Puerto Rican,
American.
He's 31 years old.
And Pero Simundza, Croatian, 26 years
old.
LIZ JACKSON: Who must take
responsibility for the deaths of the UNHCR workers in Atambua?
SERGIO VIEIRA DE MELLO, HEAD OF UN
MISSION IN EAST TIMOR: Well, first of all those who actually killed them, and
we have every reason to believe this was premeditated.
The way in which it was carried out
clearly indicates that it was not a spontaneous outburst of anger.
No, it was premeditated.
And secondly, those who did not take
the necessary protective measures to prevent this from actually taking place.
LIZ JACKSON: Are you talking the
Indonesian Army?
SERGIO VIEIRA DE MELLO: Well, I'm
talking of those who are responsible for maintaining law and order on their
territory, so essentially, the police and the army.
LIZ JACKSON: The regional command
post of the Indonesian Army, responsible for security in West Timor, is based
here in Bali.
The Indonesians have given numerous
assurances over the past 12 months that TNI soldiers WILL disarm the militias.
We travelled to Bali to ask them why
they've failed.
Major General Kiki Syahnakri is head
of the regional TNI.
He's under pressure and cut short our
time.
Can you explain to us why the TNI has
been unable to disarm the militia?
MAJOR GENERAL KIKI SYAHNAKRI, EASTERN
REGION COMMANDER, TNI: Actually, the disbanding and disarming of the militia
groups has been going ahead since they first entered West Timor, and the
militia were formally disbanded on 13 December, 1999.
However it should be understood that
these groups are idealistic and it's hard to get rid of those aspirations.
So it's logical that we haven't yet
been able to take all their weapons.
They still have them hidden and we
admit we have not yet been able to confiscate all the militia's weapons.
SERGIO VIEIRA DE MELLO: The
militiamen that we have intercepted here inside East Timor, and especially the
two who were killed some time ago, carried rifles, SKS rifles, Mausers, and I
am told some of them have been sighted carrying M16s.
Now, these are not weapons that you
can buy in shops.
These are not weapons that grow on
trees.
They come from somewhere.
MAJOR GENERAL KIKI SYAHNAKRI: Uh,
sorry.
Can you make only one again -- one
question more?
LIZ JACKSON: Now?
MAJOR GENERAL KIKI SYAHNAKRI: One
more question.
LIZ JACKSON: Do you accept that
elements of the armed forces are still supporting the militia?
MAJOR GENERAL KIKI SYAHNAKRI: There
are still rumours about that.
There is information concerning rogue
elements, not the institution.
These are rumours.
There is information that various
elements of the TNI are still supporting the militia.
But as yet we have no evidence of
that.
We have no proof or witnesses.
LIZ JACKSON: And this is really the
last question -- do you accept that the majority, most of the refugees, want to
return to East Timor?
MAJOR GENERAL KIKI SYAHNAKRI: Yes.
Most of them, they want to return to
East Timor.
LIZ JACKSON: But you cannot provide a
secure environment for that to happen?
MAJOR GENERAL KIKI SYAHNAKRI: Not
only Indonesia, but also the UNTAET in East Timor, they cannot make sure to all
of the refugees that's in East Timor they can be safe, they can protect them
and security is OK in East Timor.
So, until now, the refugees, most of
the refugees still doubt about the security in East Timor.
LIZ JACKSON: Every morning, United
Nations police officers, known here as CIVPOL, visit the small village of Hera,
about 45km out of Dili.
It's the home village of Julio
Fernandas, and they're dropping in to check that he's not getting too hard a
time from his neighbours.
It's a year now since Julio burnt
down 10 of their houses.
He's been back for less than a week.
He tells us that some folk are still
hostile towards him.
JULIO FERNANDAS: People say I'm a
militia man and that I took their belongings, but I didn't.
The people who did are still around.
Some old women came and abused me and
were angry with me.
I'm already guilty in their eyes.
I just keep quiet.
LIZ JACKSON: While talking with
Julio, we discover some interesting information about the killings in Atambua.
Julio says he knew before he left
West Timor that something was being planned, because he'd been invited to a
militia meeting six days before the attack.
JULIO FERNANDAS: We were called to a
meeting on August 30 but we refused to go.
We'd already made up our minds to go
home.
I warned my relatives that something
would happen, maybe in 4 or 5 days.
Then I heard on the radio yesterday
that three people were killed.
LIZ JACKSON (To interpreter): Who
invited him?
JULIO FERNANDAS: Eurico and the
militia, but we didn't want to go.
LIZ JACKSON: It was Eurico directly
who told you there would be trouble in early September?
JULIO FERNANDAS: He told us to follow
them but we didn't want to.
We were scared.
LIZ JACKSON: Eight days after the
UNHCR workers were killed, we find out that Eurico Guterres has another meeting
to attend, this time in a plush resort in Bali at the invitation of the
Indonesian Government.
LIZ JACKSON: Are you responsible for
the attack on the UN workers?
EURICO GUTERRES No speak English.
LIZ JACKSON: Also invited is Joao
Tavares, formerly the commander-in-chief of the East Timorese militia.
Eurico is regarded as his deputy.
Tavares is the boss.
LIZ JACKSON: Excuse me, sir.
ABC Television.
What do you hope to achieve with this
meeting?
JOAO TAVARES: I no speak English.
Speak Portuguese.
LIZ JACKSON: Is it possible to speak
Bahasa?
JOAO TAVARES: Yeah.
LIZ JACKSON: Mr Tavares, did you plan
the attack on the UN headquarters in Atambua?
JOAO TAVARES: No.
I don't know anything about it.
LIZ JACKSON: Was it part of that plan
that workers would be killed?
JOAO TAVARES: There was no plan.
There was no plan.
LIZ JACKSON: It's a top-level
meeting.
Three Indonesian Government ministers
arrive from Jakarta -- most importantly, the Minister for Political and
Security Affairs, Bambang Yudhoyono.
By reputation, he is close to
President Wahid, who has been severely embarrassed by the killings of the UN
workers.
Major General Kiki Syahnakri, whom we
met earlier in the day, comes on the same bus as Bambang Yudhoyono.
Since our interview, the Indonesian
Attorney-General has revealed that members of the Indonesian armed forces are
amongst those identified as suspects in the murder of the UN workers.
Australia's Foreign Minister,
Alexander Downer, has named Eurico Guterres as responsible for their deaths.
Now hanging around in the lobby with
Eurico is a virtual who's who of the men who organised the killings in East
Timor one year ago.
Eurico is talking with Cancio de
Lopes Carvalho.
His Mahidi militia was responsible
for the Suai massacre.
Joao Tavares, whom we met on the way
in.
Basilio Arujua is in the background,
the political face of the pro-integration militia.
These militiamen now style themselves
as leaders of a political group, which they call UNTAS.
They claim they represent the East
Timorese refugees living in the camps.
There's something disconcerting about
the apparently cordial relationship between the Minister, Bambang Yudhoyono,
and the likes of Eurico Guterres.
JOSE RAMOS HORTA: He's not a
political leader.
When the Kopassus needed someone to
terrorise the people, to do a dirty job, they unleashed him.
Who with any sense of dignity, of
self-respect, would negotiate with Eurico Guterres?
LIZ JACKSON: The meeting lasts over
three hours.
The agenda is private, but we're told
that the killings in Atambua are never once specifically referred to.
When the Minister leaves, he just
says they've been looking for a way to solve the refugee problem.
He refers to the militia by their
sanitised name of UNTAS.
BAMBANG YUDHOYONO: We want to
cooperate with all parties, including the UN, the East Timorese leadership and
UNTAS.
LIZ JACKSON: Eurico Guterres says the
Minister offered them an empty island to move to as a reward for their loyalty
to the Republic of Indonesia.
It's unclear whether the offer was
accepted.
He rejects Alexander Downer's
accusation that he is responsible for the Atambua killings.
LIZ JACKSON: Eurico, in Australia,
the Foreign Minister --
EURICO GUTERRES: I don't speak English.
(Eurico and crowd laugh)
MAN: How are you?
ANOTHER MAN: How are you today?
THIRD MAN: Today, OK. Today, OK.
LIZ JACKSON: In Bahasa. In Bahasa.
(Interpreter translates)
EURICO GUTERRES: He is responsible,
the Australian Minister for Foreign Affairs, Alexander Downer is responsible.
He's secretly bringing in his own
people and he's paying the East Timorese.
He's trying to play the East Timorese
off against each other.
He's responsible, not me.
ANOTHER REPORTER: What about spies in
West Timor?
EURICO GUTERRES: Pro-independence
people are being paid by the peacekeepers, especially by Australia.
He's sent in Australians so if an
East Timorese kills one of us, they'll be paid 25 million rupiah per head.
LIZ JACKSON: The militia leaders haven't
changed their style or their tactics since their murderous rampage in East
Timor a year ago.
The Indonesians still appear
unwilling or unable to rein them in.
Their latest commitment to disarm the
militia has been treated with violent contempt.
It's just 11 days since we first met
Jake Morland on the boat in Kupang.
Now he's at the international airport
in Bali on his way back to Britain.
All the United Nations workers and
virtually all the international aid agencies have abandoned West Timor and the
refugees.
JAKE MORLAND: Everyone is going home
for a while.
People are being debriefed on what
has happened.
We've lost friends, we've lost
colleagues.
Three people have been murdered.
So people are going home to try and
get over this and we're on stand-by.
We'll see what happens.
LIZ JACKSON: Would you ever
contemplate coming back, given what's happened?
JAKE MORLAND: I cannot even imagine
at the moment the situation improving to such an extent that we would return.
So, no, at the moment I cannot even
contemplate it.
LIZ JACKSON: Not the organisation and
not yourself?
JAKE MORLAND: Neither.
Neither.
LIZ JACKSON: The refugees in West
Timor are now on their own.
Unlike the international aid workers,
they can't take a plane home.
Word is that food in the camps is now
running low, but word from the camps is now hard to get.
The way Jake sees it, the militia
have won.
JAKE MORLAND: Obviously we are no
longer there to monitor what is going on.
So they do not have the eyes of the
world on them anymore.
They certainly have won what they
regarded as the war.
They wanted to get us out of there,
and they have done.
LIZ JACKSON: The worst case scenario
is that West Timor will now descend into the same murderous anarchy that was
seen in the East.
SERGIO VIEIRA DE MELLO: I think it is
already happening.
The worst case scenario is beginning
to materialise.